Meanwhile, in Gibraltar

The Minister for Europe (Mr David Lidington): On Wednesday 30 October an incident occurred in British Gibraltar Territorial Waters (BGTW) involving dangerous manoeuvring by a Spanish Guardia Civil boat. Following media reporting of the incident, this statement sets out the facts and the Government’s response.

During a routine transfer of personnel between Royal Navy vessels in BGTW, a Guardia Civil vessel was observed approaching at speed. As the Spanish vessel approached, the Royal Navy and Defence Police vessels at the scene followed operational procedures, including forming a protective barrier. On arriving in the vicinity, the Guardia Civil vessel conducted several dangerous manoeuvres near to the British vessels. At one point a minor collision occurred between the Guardia Civil vessel and one of the Defence Police boats. There was no damage to either vessel, no shots were fired and there were no injuries.

The UK’s Defence Attaché in Madrid raised our concerns about the incident with the Spanish Navy on Thursday 31 October. We have also raised this at a high level with the Spanish Ministry of Foreign Affairs, making clear that the actions of the Guardia Civil were unacceptable and dangerous, with the potential to cause serious injury or damage. Once the full facts of the incident had been established, a formal written protest was also issued to the Spanish Government in Madrid

gibraltar

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Repulse
November 4, 2013 9:32 pm

Surely we can atleast detain them for dangerous driving! Something has to be done as the status-quo is not an option. Someone is going get killed or seeiously injured at this rate.

All Politicians are the Same
All Politicians are the Same
November 4, 2013 9:36 pm

I understand that this got really close and made ready 7.62MM weapons were pointed in each direction. However it is one of these horrible situations where we have to be seen not to escalate.

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 4, 2013 9:50 pm

Just so I get the background clear, is this a case of disputed waters? Previous reports over the last few months leave me unclear. Is there any possibility that Carlos Fandango might start claiming he’s in the right, we are in the wrong place, or is this really black and white?

If there really is no dispute over whose waters are whose, then surely some really good metal mesh netting / buoys placed along the demarcation would be a good place to start from?

Also, what’s the state of the possible with non-lethal counters? Something to foul up the propellers, gunky foam from a fire hose (or some prize British pig swill fired from a muck spreader), ear-splitting noise…. Must be something the boys and girls in DSTL can come up with.

Swimming Trunks
Swimming Trunks
November 4, 2013 10:01 pm

Charging at high speed towards a RN vessel is not a good idea, espicially in the Med at the moment and after the Cole attack. Shit is going to happen and people will get killed.

All Politicians are the Same
All Politicians are the Same
November 4, 2013 10:11 pm

@RT

Gibraltar claims a small TTW, Spain lodged a complaint and refused to recognise them. yet they claim a full 12 miles from Cueta and refuse to recognise Moroccan TTW 12 mile limits.
To further confuse the issue the STROG is a recognised international Straight.

Effectively the Spanish are being hugely hypocritical and typically ineffective.

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 4, 2013 10:28 pm

APATS,

do not tell Mrs RT as she will pursue you to the very ends of the earth.

You know how the Eskimos have 30 words for snow? Well, left me tell you that the Spaniards have 300 words to capture the concept of haughty, murderous disdain, eternal non-forgiveness, and the ability to serve you something foul called Cardo*** every night for 11 days and eat in icy silence. You have to eventually take them to …. the daylights out of them before normal service is resumed, but get your own Spaniard for that. Hands off mine. ;)

*** AKA in English as Cardoon, which didn’t leave me any the wiser. Turns out it’s a sodding thistle.

All Politicians are the Same
All Politicians are the Same
November 4, 2013 10:32 pm

@RT
;)

I truly believe that simply ignoring their provocations over Gib is the way ahead.

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 4, 2013 10:33 pm

You can always retaliate by getting your children Christened properly without interference from Rome.

But, it takes two to Tango (happily mixing Hispanic nations and allowing for the exciting possibility that this thread could be yet another Islands one). Do the Spanish want to be ignored? If there is still a wise head in the FCO (umm, slightly doubtful), have they war-gamed through the next 7 permutations?

All Politicians are the Same
All Politicians are the Same
November 4, 2013 10:40 pm

‘RT

Though as the non easily “deployable” arm of the UK armed forces and post Germany. maybe we could respond to such provocation by putting a mech Battalion in Gib, another in the FI and a third in Cyprus?

Surely a good use of assets as the UK is unlikely to face a conventional threat. 3 1500 strong battle groups mixing mech armour and arty?

Mark
Mark
November 4, 2013 10:51 pm

Tell the Spanish government to wind there necks in our we will look favourable on the basque countries requests for independence if they should raise it at the EU.

Challenger
Challenger
November 4, 2013 10:53 pm

@APATS

I have long thought it a good idea to put a battalion on the islands down south, cold weather/mountain training and a firm garrison/deterrent in one!

Is their room on Gib for a force that size? With limited space and a population of only 30ish thousand I would have thought an influx of a few hundred soldiers and all of the associated vehicles and equipment would be a major challenge?

All Politicians are the Same
All Politicians are the Same
November 4, 2013 10:57 pm

@Challenger,

Was slightly tongue in cheek. Though yes, a 6 month BG rotation down south makes perfect sense.

wf
wf
November 4, 2013 11:05 pm

@Challenger: until the Royal Gibraltar Regiment took over, there was always a Bn group there. Should be no issue re-establishing one

@RT: the key is to channel the fire. I married Irish, and the prospect of a Prod fathering someone who the wife’s side wanted an Irish Catholic baptism for didn’t fill their local parish priest with enthusiasm for some reason. “ah well, we’ll take him to the local C of E here then”. Cue mother in law marching into said Catholic church and a discreet threat to have the bouncing baby wheeled down to either London or the C of I down the road…..space was found :-)

Gloomy Northern Boy
Gloomy Northern Boy
November 4, 2013 11:06 pm

@Challenger – I’m sure there was an Infantry Battalion there permanently until comparatively recently, plus numbers of gunners and others, along with a bigger Naval and RAF presence; unless the place has got smaller, I’d guess space could be found…

GNB

Opinion3
Opinion3
November 4, 2013 11:19 pm

I think the Spanish are just being a pain in the butt. They are playing on the territorial waters because

The territory was eventually ceded to the Kingdom of Great Britain by Spain in the 1713 Treaty of Utrecht as part of the settlement of the War of the Spanish Succession. In that treaty, Spain ceded to Great Britain “the full and entire propriety of the town and castle of Gibraltar, together with the port, fortifications, and forts thereunto belonging … for ever, without any exception or impediment whatsoever.”

Note no mention of waters – the rest is pretty specific. Common sense says they were included as 1. Britannia did rule the waves and
2. Overland trade was specifically banned between Spain and the Rock

framed
framed
November 4, 2013 11:36 pm

Red Trousers: there is a territorial waters dispute between Spain & UK/Gibraltar. In recent times, Civil Guard and Spanish Customs vessels have been attempting to exercise authority (daily) in British Gibraltar Territorial Waters. The Spanish navy has been getting in on the act (occasionally) with patrol ships (eg Tornado P44, Vencedora P79) and when confronted have responded that they were in Spanish waters.

There are several issues:
1. Spain claims Gibraltar as Spanish. It claims that Gib is part of Spain’s “territorial integrity”, a principle that overrides (so goes the claim) the wishes of the people of Gibraltar to determine their own future.
2. Whilst Gibraltar remains a British territory, Spain claims that it has no territorial waters at all except for the inner waters of the port, because when Gibraltar was ceded to the British with the 1713 Treaty of Utrecht (Article X) there was no mention of waters within the treaty (only the city, castle and the port were ceded, goes the claim). Britain claims territorial waters up to 3 miles (with the obvious adjustment in the Bay of Gibraltar/Algeciras) as per the traditional 18th century “cannon-shot rule” for seawaters associated to a land. Also both Britain and Spain have signed the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS) which has been enforced since 1982 and allows for territorial waters of up to 12 miles. Spain lodged a complaint regarding Gibraltar waters within the annexes of UNCLOS but the treaty itself says that information in the annexes cannot change the treaty of UNCLOS and thus Britain/Gibraltar claims territorial waters as a right afforded by the treaty (only 3 miles, though 12 could be claimed).
3. Spain claims that the airport and isthmus (that attaches the Rock to the Spanish frontier) does not form part of the territory ceded to Britain in the Treaty of Utrecht and thus claims that part of the territory is occupied illegally, and so the waters associated with that land are as Spanish as the land. The Gibraltar government laid an artificial reef in this area last August which particularly annoyed the Spanish government, but this latest incident did not occur in this area.

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 4, 2013 11:38 pm

APATS,

Mech Inf won’t work in the FI: ground pressure. They’ll bog in.

I do think we should recast the garrison there (well the Land bit: no comment on the blue bits). The RAF regiment should take over permanently the airfield / local GDA role, and work with the FIDF. There’s 5? squadrons, so they can rotate through quite happily at normal tour lengths, and it’s what they’re for. No other use for them, any way.

Then, have a slightly unpredictable set of exercises – a total of about 4 months of each year – for the Spearhead battalion, a sort of BATUS in the South Atlantic. The boys won’t need much in the way of home comforts for a month or so at a time – set of Nissen huts and a cookhouse and ablutions block would do, there’s enough space on the airfield.

Would also exercise the air bridge and so replicate long deployments anywhere in the world, and the maritime supply chain. Don’t make the roulements too easy to forecast and Carlos Fandango is always going to be on the back foot. Every so often throw in a port visit by a submarine and something daring by the Hooligans. Everyone gets good training.

All Politicians are the Same
All Politicians are the Same
November 4, 2013 11:46 pm

@RT
yes a lot of it is pretty boggy but those bits are pretty much unused. You are defending strategic lodes so even a few hours notice that puts modern AFVs artillery and Ad assets around MPA, Stanley and other landing areas is a big step up from where we are.

Gloomy Northern Boy
Gloomy Northern Boy
November 4, 2013 11:52 pm

@Opinion 3 – No very clear notion of territorial waters then, or for some considerable time afterwards – but I would assume that as those concepts were developed and refined their adoption in respect of agreed land frontiers was implied; and Gibraltar was very clearly agreed to be a British Territory in perpetuity. The Dons have no case, and they know it…but assume if they arse about enough we will get fed up with it and depart…or that the EU will make us give it up in the interests of “ever closer union”, or some such.

With our current political class, they might even be right…

GNB

Challenger
Challenger
November 4, 2013 11:52 pm

@APATS

I wasn’t sure how serious you were being, but yeah I like the idea of a battle-group down south never the less!

& GNB

Yeah wasn’t their a British battalion on the rock until the early 1990’s? I just thought that it might be hard to re-establish a force of that size if some of the space previously taken up by the deployment has been sold off or is used for other things. But if those buildings and spaces are still used by the Gibraltar regiment then I guess it wouldn’t be too difficult to beef the garrison up again. Not that I can really see a need to do so.

I think battalion based battle-groups down south, on Cyprus and in Brunei would be good alongside rotational training detachments going through Kenya, Germany, Canada etc. The Gulf doesn’t really need a persistent ground presence, I think an enduring and strong maritime commitment, regular aerial assets sent to the region on exercises and a bit of desert training for the Army in Oman would suffice to create an effective set-up.

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 5, 2013 1:37 am

APATS,

no, no, no, no, noooooo.

The bits where it’s pretty boggy are precisely where you do go, if OPFOR thinks it’s a bit difficult. The absolutely last thing you do is stick to the obvious bits.

Gordon effing Bennet.

You are not defending the strategic bits, because defence is a stupid game to play. You make the other bugger defend.

How do I put this simply? You make your opponent play on a 2 x 2 chess board, and you play on a 64 x 64 board. and you hope to Christ that your country has enough material wealth to equip you with Queens, Bishops and Castles while he has draughts. And you twat the fucker while he’s not looking.

Obsvr
Obsvr
November 5, 2013 8:51 am

I think Guardia Civile are part of the problem. Their history is as the fascist heavy mob, ie keeping Castile (or more precisely Barcelona) well throttled down. Since democracy they’ve been limited to plain old fashioned frontier duties, but I suspect they are looking for their former glory and Gib is the obvious playground.

Re FI, since the RAF Regt lost their GBAD role RA provides a Rapier bty continuosly in FI, given there are only 4 such btys ‘harmony guidelines’ are probably getting a bit of a workout.

Engineer Tom
Engineer Tom
November 5, 2013 9:15 am

Surely we have vehicles capable of being used in boggy areas, I’m thinking the Viking or Wathog to start, and maybe some of the others.

a
a
November 5, 2013 10:54 am

Send the RAF Regt to the Falklands for ever? You are a cruel, cruel person. :)

Surely we have vehicles capable of being used in boggy areas, I’m thinking the Viking or Wathog to start, and maybe some of the others.

IIRC they used Scimitar down there in 1982, and I don’t remember hearing that it had trouble with being bogged in – but others are probably better placed than me to comment. Surely Viking would be OK, it’s designed for arctic conditions after all. Argocats in place of quad-bikes for the infantry CSMs – IIRC they’re designed for use in the Highlands, so bogs are their natural habitat.

Brian Black
Brian Black
November 5, 2013 11:09 am

During the Olympics, the Marines deployed the LRAD 1000Xi (Long Range Acoustic Device) on the Thames.

Essentially a directional and uncomfortably loud hailer and noise maker. Has an integral MP3 player, so you can broadcast Basil Fawlty clips at Spaniards. Laser dazzler or blindingly bright spotlight options too.

Step 1 – Operator broadcasts directions/instructions in a loud, clear voice

Step 2 – If direction is not taken, operator then broadcasts with a more authoritative message

Step 3 – If directions/instructions are not taken, operator employs the LRAD deterrent tone towards people/persons creating the threatening situation

http://www.lradx.com/site/content/view/323

Unfortunately this does not emit the (amusing but probably fictional) ‘brown noise’, but seems like just the thing for Gibraltar.

Alternatively, the Border Agency cutters carry a hose. We could send one of those down to fire pig slurry at the trouble makers.

Engineer Tom
Engineer Tom
November 5, 2013 11:34 am

Isn’t that what they use to blast Britney Spears at pirates. :)

Gloomy Northern Boy
Gloomy Northern Boy
November 5, 2013 11:46 am

I personally have nothing against the RAF Regiment, but I do think that their continued existence would be easier to justify if they did garrison MPA, Cyprus and indeed any other distant base where we have aircraft as a matter of routine…and putting a Field Squadron at Gibraltar would certainly fit in to that category, and represent a modest ratcheting up of our position without being unnecessarily provocative. Mind you, to do those jobs effectively they would need the Rapiers back and some light armour…based at the bases in question.

@RT – I know you went to Sandhurst, and I’d guess you acquired a degree or two at some point in your long career, before retiring loaded with honours at quite senior rank and taking up pretty serious work in the defence sector…hence your masterly and thoughtful summary of the offensive doctrine in mobile warfare as “Twatting the Fuckers when they aren’t looking…”

It makes me proud to be British…seriously…also puts me in mind of a favourite Yorkshire expression often heard in the ramshackle and under-invested factories of my youth “That fucking fuckers fucking fucked!”. A celebration of the glories of good Anglo-Saxon in my view…

GNB

Fedaykin
November 5, 2013 12:00 pm

@All Politicians are the Same

Agreed! In the end Spain wants a violent confrontation so they can act all hurt in-front of the international community and bolster public opinion in a financially bankrupt country.

Considering that if we are to be honest on shaky ground anyway when it comes to how much of the waters we are entitled to or the location of the airport it is best to maintain the status quo.

I think we would be better placed installing better high resolution long range day night cameras overlooking the harbour and waters so we can better record what the Guardia Civil and other Spanish interlopers are getting up to. That way we can present that clear footage to the international media to better show the dangerous behaviour of the Spanish authorities.

I also think it is a mistake to increase the RN or Army presence on the Rock beyond what we already have, again it plays into the international victim narrative that Spain wants to portray about the situation. Far better to keep our military low key and to a degree above these silly distractions. A better solution is to look at helping the Gibraltar Police procure and operate some better resources. In particular:

1) A couple of larger and faster patrol boats that can keep up and face down the Guardia Civil fast patrol boats (again with suitable HD day night cameras installed to record what happens close up).

2) A couple of small helicopters equipped with HD cameras (Eurocopter EC135 with Wescam or something similar) that can respond quickly to situations in the bay and again record what is happening or transmit territorial warnings. A helicopter operating out of the airport could intercept a Guardia Civil boat further out and quicker.

By improving the Gibraltar polices ability to intercept and record these confrontations it keeps it a civil matter and avoids giving the military confrontation the Spanish would so love to have!

Engineer Tom
Engineer Tom
November 5, 2013 12:16 pm

I would have thought the FI garrison should be a RAF Regiment unit working with RAF/MOD Police to guard MPA, with specialist equipment attached from other units i.e. Rapier etc., along with the Garrison itself being an Army/RM unit (Battalion level hopefully) on a 3-6 month deployment, doing the odd training exercise to alleviate the boredom.

wf
wf
November 5, 2013 12:36 pm

The RAF Regiment role should be transferred to the Army, who need to establish permanent “inf coy with attachments” units anyway, for rear-area defense and convoy escort for starters. Why not add a company to battalions and have this role rotate between the companies?

x
x
November 5, 2013 12:46 pm

The trouble will come when one of those CG chaps is caught out smuggling or undertaking some other illicit behaviour and decides to cover his tracks by shooting. Only a matter of time as a good many of them are bent. Can’t be seen to escalate no. But I fear we are heading towards casualties and I fear it will be a Gibraltarian or a Briton. Consider from which direction the parties involved are coming, ranges, etc.

http://www.onlinecasinoking.com/casinoblog/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Gibraltar.jpg

Not good,

Engineer Tom
Engineer Tom
November 5, 2013 12:59 pm

The Army doesn’t want the role. Personally I think the RAF should have retained the Rapier and I could see a joint system working, i.e. Royal Artillery are responsible for Air defence and maintain all the Rapier systems with a few manned by RAF personnel when deployed for airfield defence. Also as someone pointed out on another post the RAF Regiment is trained to defened airfields and so is less likely to do something stupid in a dangerous enironment i.e. drive onto a runway without checking with the ATC.

x
x
November 5, 2013 1:24 pm

Somebody is going to get killed soon or injured.

wf
wf
November 5, 2013 1:59 pm

@x: agreed. Video of each infraction and a non-stop political commentary about how dumb and irresponsible the Spanish are being should be coming out at all times. When the inevitable happens, cover the Guardia Civil with shit, and shut this down for a few years :-(

a
a
November 5, 2013 2:07 pm

..your masterly and thoughtful summary of the offensive doctrine in mobile warfare as “Twatting the Fuckers when they aren’t looking…”

Slim quotes, approvingly, what a Sandhurst RSM said to him as a junior officer: “Never you mind about the Rules of Warfare. There’s only one Rule of Warfare. Hit the other fellow as hard as you can, as fast as you can, where it hurts the most, when he isn’t looking.”

Gloomy Northern Boy
Gloomy Northern Boy
November 5, 2013 3:44 pm

@ Engineer Tom – inclined to agree, although it will cost me an extra pint next time I’m down Greenwich way…

@x – I fear you may be right; as long as it is one of theirs, very obviously their fault, and carefully recorded on video for the inevitable court of enquiry…

@a – I wonder if Slim paraphrased for the benefit of a family audience; perhaps @RT met the same RSM or one of his successors, but has offered us the same wisdom in the original vernacular…

GNB

x
x
November 5, 2013 3:52 pm

@ GNB

I fear it will be one of our “service personnel” “not escalating” or worse some civilian in Gib because CG have loosed off a few rounds.

@ WF

The CG has far too many rotten apples.

Engineer Tom
Engineer Tom
November 5, 2013 4:25 pm

I wonder what would happen if we fitted under water spikes to all of our boats off Gib, as long as they ram us so it’s their fault it could be quite amusing to see their fancy speed boats sinking.

Bit extreme but they need to be taught a lesson.

WiseApe
November 5, 2013 6:56 pm

There’s still plenty of room on Gib…..if you don’t mind living in caves. A fair bit of modern Gib is built on land reclaimed from the sea – so not covered by the Treaty of Utrecht?

Don’t quite see how putting a load of troops back would stop the Spaniards buggering about at the border crossing or off shore. Which reminds me, whatever happened to that EU “fact finding mission?”

Topman
Topman
November 5, 2013 7:34 pm

Re moving troops into Gib. Buildings and space to put them all would be an issue. Last time I was there that had sold off quite a lot of MoD land with a plan to sell more. The plan is to centralise as much as possible on as few plots of land as possible, DTC is being expanded that with the Navy base will contain nearly everything out there. I’d say even a small increase in numbers would be a struggle. An inf btn plus support would be what 800?

Stewart Hitchen
Stewart Hitchen
November 5, 2013 9:46 pm

about 10 years ago the sub nets were in the tunnels if they have not been scrapped they would be a cheap fix

Gloomy Northern Boy
Gloomy Northern Boy
November 5, 2013 10:04 pm

@SH – Re-set them as a combined-arms logistic exercise – claiming to have intelligence to the effect that A/Q have purchased a couple of North Korean Mini Subs…

Simples!

GNB

dave haine
dave haine
November 5, 2013 10:14 pm

The unfortunate thing is that with all the video in the world, unless someone gets hurt, the spaniards, or more precisely those Franco era relics, the Guardia Civille, are going to carry on with their low grade harassment, in order to provoke a response.

As unpleasant as it sounds, if all the news channels end up showing a film of a Gib bobbie, or a Matelot getting blatted by a GC idiot, the moral high ground is then occupied by Gib and all will go quiet (the Gib politicians seem to be awfully adept at point scoring) . An awfully high cost I know, but how high a price do you place on peace and self-determination?

The other option is to ramp up the military presence, which in the end I think will just allow ‘the bleeding hearts and artists to make their stand’ (guess who).

I suppose an RAF Regiment sqn based on Gib would make the statement that we will defend. Perhaps better than an army unit which has a certain offensive quality.

To change the subject slightly, I once had reason to call up our Maintrol (line engineers) to ask what was wrong with an aeroplane, the answer i got (from a ex-Halton ‘brat’ and twenty year RAF service, before twenty years with us, proper engineer-oil running through his veins, instead of blood, lived on tea and fags, never slept) was:
“The fucking fuckers fucked, for fucks sake, now fuck of and let me fix the fucking thing”
“Cheers bill”

Gloomy Northern Boy
Gloomy Northern Boy
November 5, 2013 10:22 pm

@DH – Was he a Yorkshire Lad by any chance?

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 5, 2013 10:29 pm

Cloud seeding.

Having spent many happy summer weeks in Mrs RT’s family villa 5 miles north of Gib, there’s some special type of meteorology going on, reliably, every afternoon with a type of cloud that forms directly over the Rock, then with the prevailing wind hangs over Algeciras bay and about 10 miles northwestwards over a number of seaside Spanish towns.

There’s got to be possibilities. Mortar up some airburst chemicals from the reverse slope of the Rock and unseen by Carlos Fandango to cause rain on Spain, falling mainly on the expensive seaside resorts.

dave haine
dave haine
November 5, 2013 10:30 pm

@GNB

No, from Gloucestershire, always claimed he knew Laurie Lee.

Red Trousers
Red Trousers
November 5, 2013 10:33 pm

This: http://fineartamerica.com/featured/rock-of-gibraltar-cloud-ii-uk-territory-john-a-shiron.html

DH, I reckon he’s missed out at least three fuckers in that lot, and it would scan better.

El Sid
El Sid
November 5, 2013 10:58 pm

I used to think if there was reincarnation, I wanted to come back as the president or the pope or a .400 baseball hitter. But now I want to come back as the bond market. You can intimidate everybody. ” [James Carville]

Sending troops is so 20th century. Just get the BoE to buy up a few £bn of the right Spanish bonds and you have the potential to hold their government to ransom next time they need to refinance – there’s a lot of nasties still lurking in the Eurozone despite the recent positive vibes, Spanish bonds are tottering on the edge of junk status.

dave haine
dave haine
November 5, 2013 11:02 pm

@ RT

Similar thing happens on Madeira, something to do with moisture laden winds off the sea, being pushed into colder, higher levels and condensing.

Wouldn’t it be better to keep the rain for parts of Gib, and then sell the water to the spanish?

Indeed it would but I am quoting, and he was aware that there were women in the room.

It was a sort of tannoy/ loudspeaker thing, in fact, all our conversations used to have to start “females present, bill”. He was also renowned for pressing the wrong buttons, and launching a tirade of invective across the pilots briefing room, or the hanger canteen, or indeed on one memorable occasion, reception, as a visiting MOD party were signing in.

I suppose we could have just used the landline, but somehow…..

as
as
November 5, 2013 11:32 pm

patrol boat crews should be armed with these might stop the Spaniard’s getting to close.

Peter Elliott
November 6, 2013 5:29 am

In the bus and coach industry we have many words regional dialect words for a bus that is broken.

In Manchester its a “Demic”
In Birmingham its an “Nail”
In Sheffield its a “Crock”
But in Essex it is “Faaaaak’d”

dave haine
dave haine
November 6, 2013 8:10 am

@ Peter Elliott

Ah yes, in my airline aeroplanes ‘fall over’ when they’re broke, but people go ‘tech’.

WiseApe
December 11, 2013 8:08 pm